SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT ACP AND FIXATION PAY
Dear Comrades!
Some questions about fixation of TBOP/BCR Postmen Pay and the usefulness of ACP Scheme for the Promotees have come before us and as we are going to discuss in the ensuing 22nd September Federal Executive Meeting. Therefore comrades, particularly from P4 and R4 including Adminstrative Union, are requested to interact with their General Secretaries after analysing the following points:
- Some DDOs do not fix correctly the upgraded Grade Pay to TBOP Postmen and BCR Postmen. They say clear directions or instructions have not come from Directorate. Similarly in some places the upgraded PB-1 is not given to the Matriculate Group D and higher Grade Pay for TBOP and BCR Group D [Matriculates] also not given. What is the reason?
- Whether ACP Scheme has been ordered by the Department of Posts? Whether we will get upgradation of pay in accordance with 3 ACP Scheme immediately?
- Whether the ACP Scheme is beneficial to Promotee Postmen and Promotee PA/SA? If yes how and if No why?
ANSWERS:
- Many DDOs in different Circles have correctly fixed the higher Grade Pay for TBOP and BCR level of Postmen without any problem. We learn that whose Circles which have used the Pay Fixation Software supplied by Mysore PTC have done the fixation more or less correctly. Even in many other Circles there is no problem with the fixation. Only in some circles the DDOs are taking a position that without a clear direction from the Directorate to fix on the exact higher Grade Pay for TBOP and BCR level officials, they won't fix it in higher level. Anyway the Federation and the P4 CHQ took up the matter with the Directorate and also in the formal meeting on 16th September 2008 with the Member [P]. But the Department has taken a position that this instruction or direction would be issued only after our accepting or rejecting the ACP Scheme so that they can instruct to fix it either according to ACP basis or TBOP/BCR basis. Therefore it will take some more time because NFPE can accept or reject the ACP Scheme only after the matter has been discussed in the 22nd September Federal executive meeting at Thiruvananthapuram. On our writing to Department about our accepting or rejecting the ACP Scheme, the Directorate has assured to release clear instructions in this regard.
- ACP Scheme has been modified by the Pay Commission and further modified / improved by the Government. But order from DOPT about the modified structure of ACP is yet to be notified. Even though we have discussed the issue with the Department of Posts on 16.09.2008 and that the Department also has agreed to implement the ACP Scheme for postal employees on our acceptance, the Staff Side has not given its consent letter for agreeing ACP Scheme instead of TBOP/BCR Scheme so far. We will give such a letter only after the issue is discussed in the ensuing Federal Executive Meeting in Thiruvananthapuram on 22.09.2008. However the ACP Scheme will be implemented only after the Government issuing new Modified ACP Scheme orders and the Department issuing another order for implementing it to the employees of Postal Department. This may take some more time.
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- As per the modified 3 ACP Scheme, after completion of 30 years of service, the direct recruit PA/SA will reach upto 4600/= Grade Pay; Direct Recruit Postmen will reach up to 4200/= Grade Pay; and the upgraded Group D will reach up to 2400/= Grade Pay. However Promotee officials cannot reach up to the same level. This is because the promotion from one cadre to the other by passing the examination or by seniority is considered as one upgradation already obtained in the service of the official. Therefore out of total 3 ACP upgradations, only the remaining upgradations will be given . For example if a Postman has passed examination and has become a PA, then he is eligible for only two more ACPs and not 3 ACPS. Therefore he cannot go to 4600/= Grade Pay level but only up to 4200/= Grade Pay level on completion of 30 years of service. If a Group D has become Postman and then a PA then he is eligible for only one more ACP in his service on completion of 30 years of service, which means he will reach only 2800/=Grade Pay level. This is the negative effect in comparison to our TBOP/BCR Scheme. However TBOP is after 16 years of service and BCR after 26 years of service and there is no third level in this Scheme. But ACP is after 10 years of service and then 20 years of service and also on 30 years of service. This is the difference.
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- However you can see that a Postman who remains in the same cadre of Postman through out his service will reach 4200/= Grade Pay on completion of 30 years of service. At the same time a Postman promoted as Postal Assistant also will reach the Tsame 4200/= Grade Pay on completion of his 30 years of total service. No difference at all.
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- In rare cases, a GDS who had become Group D after 10 years of service, and then became a Postman may not have 30 years of regular total service before his retirement. Such officials may not be able to get the 3rd ACP at all.
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- The negative aspect of ACP against the Promotee officials can be offset only through 'CADRE RESTRUCTURING SCHEME" which is nothing but a 'New Promotional Scheme' under which without such restrictions to move up in the ladder of promotion, Promotee Officials also can move up to reach the level of 3rd ACP available to Direct Recruits under ACP Scheme. Therefore the Staff Side is seriously working on a Cadre Restructuring Scheme even though no Cadre Restructuring Scheme will be possible without matching savings under the DOPT Guidelines on this matter.
All are free to comment on this matter. But one basic thing all should not forget is that there cannot be any condition in accepting the ACP. Because it is simply a matter of accept it if you like or reject it if you don't like it, is the reaction of the Government. Any suggestion for improving the ACP might be taken up with the Government through the National Council JCM Forum in future; but cannot be linked with any condition immediately. This is the situation at present.
As we are leaving towards Thiruvananthapuram to discuss all the above issues in our NFPE Federal Executive meeting, your suggestions and opinions through email or through your comments here in the website itself or over telephone to Secretary General or your General Secretary is very much welcome.
--
K.Ragavendran
Secretary General NFPE
respected,
ReplyDeletecomrade...
accepting the ACP scheme it is more benificial.Please go ahead.
with regards....
Kalpana Das,
KOLKATA-WB
Dear Com.
ReplyDeleteIf the condition that the no. of promotions will be counted right from the entry cadre in govt. service is modified as 'in every cadre'thre cannot be any grievance from the promotees. In that case if a group D official is promoted to the cadre of Postman (in our department) he will be grtting 3ACP in Postmen Cadre.
Balasubramanian E, TIRUR-KERALA
Respected Comrade,
ReplyDeleteAs you have correctly assessed, very few will be available in the Department who may not get the 3rd ACP. In future , this problem may be solved if the proposed cadre restructuring proposal is given the right direction by the Staff Side. So there may not be any hesitation right now on the part of the Staff Side to accept the modified A C P Scheme without any precondition. While accepting TBOP / BCR scheme , as everybody knows, we have already sacrificed a good number of posts and consequent upon acceptance of the new ACP scheme, the present system of TBOP / BCR scheme will be done away with. At this critical juncture, to be very honest, neither we can demand for return of those posts nor the Govt. will rethink ever in this regard. Therefore, this time, we have to be very careful while we will surrender posts under this modified ACP scheme.
We have every hope that you and my General Secretary Com K V Sridharan will handle this sensitive issue with utmost care in the Federal Executive meeting on 22nd instant and do resolve something positively for the benefit of the mass.
With Revolutionary Greetings.
Comradely yours,
Bruhaspati Samal.
D/S, AIPEU, Group-C
Bhubaneswar Division - 751 004
Whatever the pros & con please go for ACP . Thinking to much about future may derail the ACP scheme.NEXT pay commission (2018?) will come up with another new ideas.
ReplyDeleteTarak N Bhattacharyya
While granting ACP to IP Officials dept. of PER and TRG clarified that when an official promoted on the basis of vacancy based (competitive examination) to a different cadre, such officials should be considered as a direct recruit to that cadre for ACP. It means that a PA promoted to IP cadre he will get first ACP after 10 yrs of service in IP cadre where how many years of service he served in PA cadre or he has got a promotion to IP cadre is not relevent wrt existing rulings on ACP scheme (refer ADMN & EST of Swamy pbln). Whereas if the PA is promoted to LSG cadre through FTP / 1/3rd examination, he will not get next ACP after 10 yrs of service in LSG cadre because LSG is a position in normal heirachical channel of promotion. This is the case of Postman & Group D of our dpt promoted to PA cadre. A Postman cannot be promoted to PA cadre automatically. So as per the rules in vogue Postman/ Group D promotees to PA cadre is eligible for ACP after 10 yrs, 20 yrs in the PA cadre (based on the analogy of IP cadre). This point is even agreed by the hono'ble CAT Ernakulam during arguement stage of ACP case filed by me for non-introduction of ACP to PA cadre. But later refused to grant the relief as the Unions stand that TBOP/BCR is advantageous than ACP introduced by 5th Pay Commission was upheld by the Principal CAT New Delhi which has been produced by the DOP at the last stage of the arguement. So I was advised to file my case in higher court of Principal CAT including Union as a respondent or withdraw the case for filing subsequently. I has taken the decision to withdraw the case. This is for your kind information.
ReplyDeleteK J THOMAS
SPM NSH MOUNT
To
ReplyDeleteThe General Secretary,
NFPE Class III,
DOP, New Delhi
Sir,
Sub: Acceptance of ACP Scheme & allotment of higher Grade
Pay (4200) for TBOP/ACP-1 – reg.
* * *
As seen from the 6th CPC report, the Scale of 4500-125-7000 was upgraded to higher pay scale and allotted Grade Pay of Rs.4200/- for the following posts in various Departments.
Sl.No. Post Department
1 Head Clerk/Assistants Office Staff Working in Organistations outside the Secretariate
2 Primary School Teacher Teachers
3 Technical Assistants Ministry of Consumer Affairs, Food and Public Distribution
4 Machine man/Operator Offset Ministry of Defence
5 Technical Assistants in Centre for Marine Living Resources & Ecology, Kochi Minstry of Earth Sciences
6 Professional /Statastical Assistants Ministry of Power
7 UDC Incharge Ministry of Urban Development
Etc., and many more cadres in so many departments except DOP
No doubt in it, it will be more and more benefit for accepting ACP scheme for the DOP. By allotting Rs.4200/- Grade Pay for TBOP cadre (ie, ACP-1) it will be more and more useful for the Direct Recruits in PA cadre as well as Promotees from Postmen and Gr’D’.
If a Gr’D’ official promoted to Postman and then to PA, the official will get Rs.4200/- Grade pay after completion of 10 years in PA cadre if Rs.4200/- is allotted to TBOP/ACP-1. As such fight to allot Grade pay Rs.4200/- for TBOP/ACP-1 is very beneficial for promotees/Direct Recruits.
Finally, it is requested sir kindly take the matter with the dept. and get it switch over to ACP scheme from TBOP/BCR and also get it Rs.4200/- grade pay for TBOP/ACP-1 which is beneficial to both Direct Recruits and Promotees.
Secretary & Members
NFPE, MACHILIPATNAM DIVISION,
AP CIRLCE.
Dear comrades
ReplyDeleteKinly accept 3 ACP in the Dept. of Posts, immediately instead of thinking of TBOP/BCR as total employees are willing to have 3 ACP only.
Henc kindly honour the opinion of total postal employees of Gr-C and Gr-D who are willing to have 3 ACP immplementation immediately.
B.Satyanarayana Goud,
Org.Secretary, AIPEU Gr-C,
Karimangar Dn.505001 AP.
Dear Comrade Chennu - While the 6th CPC upgraded the 4500-7000 scale in respect of some cadres in some departments, it has kept it as same in respect of many other cadres in different departments including Postal - The CPC categorically denied higher pay for LSG/TBOP - Secondly the TBOP level is not 4200/= Grade Pay as you have stated but only 2800/= - It will not be possible under ACP to jump over any Grade Pay from lower to higher viz, from 2400/= Grade Pay to 4200/= Grade Pay by jumping over 2800/= is disallowed in ACP Scheme - Thirdly a Group D promoted to Postman and then to PA can never reach 4200/= Grade Pay under ACP at all but he can only reach 2800/= Grade Pay not after 10 years of PA service but on completion of a total 30 years service inclusive of Group D, Postman and PA Service - These are the negative aspects under ACP and we are considering Cadre Restructuring Promotional Scheme in addition to ACP to offset these obstacles - Hope this clears the position.
ReplyDeleteDear Sir,
ReplyDeletePeople all over the division are eagerly awaiting the ACP and generally people are so happy about it & expecting it. If denied it will create nothing less than a revolution among our staff and I can sense the same not only in our division but in the neighbouring division as well. Pls accept ACP at any cost. If it is modified as mentioned by the Machilipattinam division with a grade pay of Rs.4200/- it will be the icing on the cake. We expect you will respect our sentiments.
Dinesh, Sys Mgr, Chennai City North Dvn
Dear Comrade,
ReplyDeleteFollowing arguements may please be placed in so far as matching savings for cadre restructuring is considered.
We have already offered some matching savings for getting TBOP/BCR. If we now switch over out of TBOP / BCR these matching savings will not be restored. e.g. 5% / 10 % etc. cut in staff strength both in operative / supervisory cadres. Some allowances like that of admissible to SPMs etc. These will accrue to the Department on recurring basis. These recurring savings to be taken as matching savings for cadre restructuring or else, if the fresh matching savings is insisted upon, these matching savings offered for TBOP/BCR are to be restored on our moving out of TBOP/BCR.
Weightage to those completing some more years after 10 / 20 years of service are to be considered - otherwise, say those completing 15 years or 25 years and almost due for TBOP/BCR will be at loss. Seniors have always been at disadvantage in both 4th & 5the CPCs.
Some minimum benefit are to be ensured on each promotion.
In state governments like that of Karnataka, both time bound and norm based promotions are admissible. Norm based promotion will not exclude the time bound promotions.
Group C & D cadres are the actual farmers in the Department and the whole Department is being fed by these farmers.
While taking decision in acceptance of ACP, the percentage of employees who are in favour of this ACP should be taken into account.Your opinion poll has already refelct the expectation of employees. This may kindly be looked into and decision may be taken accordingly.
ReplyDeleteDear Comrades - Please undrstand that the ACP Scheme is for the entire Central Government Departments and no one have any choice about modifying its statutory provisions in any manner. Yes it is correct to demand adjustment of matching savings already given out by us towards TBOP/BCR while framing Cadre Restructuring now. we intend doing it only.
ReplyDeleteRespected Sir,
ReplyDeleteActually our opinion for allotting Rs.4200/- as Grade pay for TBOP is instead of Rs.2800/- in the old pay scale 4500-125-7000 but not from Rs.2400/- grade pay to Rs.4200/- directly as you said in your reply.
My correct opinion is
that old pay scale Rs.4500-7000 should be upgraded to Rs.5000-8000 sothat grade pay for TBOP/ACP-1 will be allotted as Rs.4200/- instead of Rs.2800/-. ie., our old age problem of denial of higher pay for TBOP will be solved with this amendment.
NFPE
Dear Comrade Chennu - the demand for upgrading 4500-7000 into pre-revised 5000-8000 on par with Telecom was indeed raised by NFPE in our Note to Secretary [P] on 17th April 2008. However the Department not agreeing to take up the issue in that angle but proposes delayering of LSG so that PA can directly go into 4200 Grade Pay as first promotion. Our concern is to ensure not only LSG but also TBOP able to reach 4200 Grade Pay. The Cadre Restructuring that we are working out is only in that angle.
ReplyDeleteRespected Sirs,
ReplyDeleteAs the above comparison has very significant factor being both Postman and PA is falling under PB1 and then to PB2 by accepting 3ACP, One should consider that the Direct PA entering into PB2 earlier than Postman and enjoying another higher grade pay of Rs. 4600 in PB2.
In Our Dept. of Posts. Postman promotee entering to PA cadre is demoralised if we accept 3 ACP blindly. Moreover We cannot give any conditions to the Govt. while accepting 3ACP for the time being.
Here the case is only of Promotee Postman rest is more or less already justified, if it is agreed as we assumed.
Our strong and simple appeal is Consider Postman service only in the case of Promotee postman to any higher cadre here it is PA ( It is not assured promotion. It is got by passing the examination ). Say If a Postman passed PA examination after 3 years of his Postman service, he should entitled to get his 1st ACP after 7 years and fixed at Grade pay of 2800 like Direct PA. not 10 years, rest ACP is as usual. It is also true that Postman what we consider is that majority of Postmen are nothing but GDS promotees. GDS service also rewarded indirectly.
Another suggestion is Fix the same Grade Pay to both Postman and PA of Rs. 2400. However Pay Band should not the same PA should kept higher.
Govt. also already declared it will pay more for those who are daily public contact personnel .Postman is also one of them. Now We got only Rs.100 Grade Pay and immediate next pay stage 3050 to 3200 having Only Rs. 10
incriment . Grade pay of Rs. 2400 could be justified by giving Computer training to Postmen as Group D will be upgraded by matriculation or six months training. It may help in carrying work like entering accountable articles ( RL . MO entries ) by himself. This point is very relevent as there may be process of Cadre re structuring. Here also Postman service should be taken into account if he passes PA examination for ACP.
We hope that above points will be taken into account by our Supreme Comrades.
Thanking You Sirs.
POSTMEN & GROUPD
AIPEU MANGALORE DIVISION
Dear Comrades - Please understand that ACP is only for those officials who could not get their regular promotion but stagnating. IF regular promotion is obtained by way of comepetitive examination then it is considered that there is no stagnation. However your suggestion that after 7 years of PA service the promotee postman should be given another promotion to 2800 grade pay etc is not possible under ACP. That is why we are trying to work out a cadre restructuring promotional scheme to ensure better promotional benefits and people can go up better than ACP.Await for the decisions of the federal executive on 22nd September 2008.
ReplyDeleteDear Comrades - Please understand that ACP is only for those officials who could not get their regular promotion but stagnating. IF regular promotion is obtained by way of comepetitive examination then it is considered that there is no stagnation. However your suggestion that after 7 years of PA service the promotee postman should be given another promotion to 2800 grade pay etc is not possible under ACP. That is why we are trying to work out a cadre restructuring promotional scheme to ensure better promotional benefits and people can go up better than ACP.Await for the decisions of the federal executive on 22nd September 2008.
ReplyDeleteACP scheme should be without any condition. No condition should be laid down to access ACP benefit. As you aware that ACP scheme have condition number 6 where it is mention that
ReplyDelete"All promotion norms have to be fulfilled for upgradation under the Scheme."
As such, no upgradation shall be allowed if an employee fails to qualify departmental exam/skill test prescribed for purpose of regular promotion.
Dear sirs,
ReplyDeletewould you please clarify some doubts regarding pay fixation?
pay as on 1-1-2006 before pay revision is Rs 5200 (including the increment on 1-1-2006) promoted to TBOP on 1-3-2006 with basic pay as Rs 5250.-opted for fixation on 1-1-2007 with basic pay as Rs 5500.- and on 1-1-2008 basic pay is Rs 5625. pay fixed in the revised structure at Rs 13640.-on 1-9-2008.kindly inform the correct fixation
SIR,
ReplyDeleteI AM A CENTRAL GOVT EMPLOYEE WORKING AS “LIBRARY AND INFORMATION ASSISTANT “ SINCE JUNE 1994 AND COMPLETED 12 YEARS OF REGULAR SERVICE IN 2006. BUT MY CADRE CONTROLLING AUTHORITY (EASTERN NAVAL COMMAND) ISSUED ME A GRANT LETTER OF FIRST ACP IN SEPT 2009. I WAS APPOINTED IN 5500-9000 SCALE AND 4200 GRADE PAY. NOW AFTER FIRST ACP WHERE MY PAY WILL BE FIXED AND WHAT WILL BE MY GRADE PAY ? AS 5500 AND 6500 SCALES HAVE BEEN MERGED WHERE DO I STAND NOW ? PLEASE ADVICE.
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